I think we can be pretty certain that this is a hardware problem, and not software one.
They might have fixed at the manufacturing process, but there are still a lot of 808s in the wild that are not working properly...
Also, if they have fixed it, they should supply units to all care points for exchnage, or at least exchange the faulty part.. which doesn't seem to be the case here in the US, at least not for now. I will have to send mine in again .. I am just wondering if I should wait longer..
2013-01-11 6:13 - edited 2013-01-11 6:27
Where did you find those changelogs?????????????????
That's amazing stuff.
As to what this is...
I would put money on this:
HSPA needs a lot more power than 3G or anything lower. Probably 5x to 10x more power. (Obviously this is true only if data is being solidly transferred).
There is a power supply circuit which either can't quite deliver the current, or overheats after some time and shuts down.
I am an electronics hardware/software engineer but have never designed a whole phone. I have played with GSM/GPRS modem modules (RIM used to make those, before they found their mountain of gold with the Blackberry, after which they removed all the modem stuff from their website and sent a team of lawyers to harrass anybody whose website carried information on them, like mine did!) and they used to draw a LOT of power and more so when transmitting. But GPRS is nothing compared to HSPA in duty cycle of the transmitter.
There is no free lunch - megabit data rates need a LOT of power. One day I will measure the actual power draw of the phone with different widgets and apps running (needs a messy battery wire-up) but I would bet HSPA running solidly draws more power than the backlight on max brightness.
So the fix is probably not a "transistor" and certainly not a "capacitor" as widely written on the web.
They could probably do it in software by restricting the transmitter duty cycle, which would reduce the data rate, and would be "somewhat" unethical
"Also, if they have fixed it, they should supply units to all care points for exchnage, or at least exchange the faulty part.. which doesn't seem to be the case here in the US, at least not for now. I will have to send mine in again .. I am just wondering if I should wait longer.."
The problem I have trying to buy the 808 here in the UK is that all 808s I can see for sale are Malaysian grey imports (including all those from amazon.co.uk which is where the BUY link on nokia.co.uk points you to) and the UK Nokia service centres won't touch these, so the only way to get an 808 fixed here will be to send it to Malaysia. Or of course return it to the supplier, but they can't fix it; all they can do is swap it for another one (with the same problem) or give you a refund (which you don't actually want).
It would be great to know what S/N onwards Nokia fixed this. But, obviously, they are not going public with that because they want to shift their old stocks first.
This kind of thing happens frequently. Pentax did a huge foulup on the K5 camera, on which about 50% were shipped with defective CCDs. There was a lot of posting on the Pentax forums of body serial numbers and eventually it became apparent at which point Pentax fixed it. I don't know what happened about the grey imports (which are a BIG scene in cameras); I think you had to return the camera to the vendor.
From France... i just bought a 808 and as discribed in this thread the system has crashed ( black screen ) out of the box when i tried to connect to the store and the day after twice again during email reception.
I took immediatly the decision to send it back to the vendor to be repaid. I'm really disapointed :/
2013-01-12 7:22 - edited 2013-01-12 7:23
Would you have the S/N of that phone, resetsmith?
It would be really useful if people with the specific blank-screen issue posted their serial numbers.
finally. on 10.01.2013 w.support and nokia decided to swap my nokia 808 after waing nearly whole month
to get my phone fixed......
hoperfully , i ll get a full functional device .....
the new imei will be lowwer count as imei of my original phone ...
does that mean that the swapped device is , maybe , older than my original phone ?????
if i received my phone , ill immedieately check whether bug is gone or not ....
keep you up to date ....
Serial of original 808 pureview White is : 059M958
old imei was about 351965050014XXXX
new is 35196505006XXXX
Also, your theory on the problem being related to power sounds plausable... they should just start replacing the old boards with new ones once they get the devcies for service..
My two 808s had 26 / 2012 on the box... so they were from the same batch, and both had the exact same problem.. random reboots on HSPA.
2013-01-12 21:24 - edited 2013-01-12 21:41
Barl Trading and Tech Trading were Malaysian imports, but today the Barl Trading price has gone up by about £100 so maybe not anymore... It changes several times each day. No point in keeping track of it until the phone is fixed, IMHO.
I think all Amazon sellers are grey imports. Today, I see some listing from Hong Kong.
I am sure the hardware fix is easy. While obviously it's outrageous to be selling a phone with this defect, hoping that a % of people won't notice, I personally would have no real issue with buying one and sending it off to be fixed before using it seriously. The problem is that with a grey import one can't do that. Nokia in the EU won't touch it. I have put this Q to all the Amazon.co.uk traders and those who replied (most) have avoided answering that question. So I take it that one indeed cannot get it fixed in the EU.
Maybe a Nokia service shop will do it for some money, but how much? I don't have time right now to be phoning up Nokia service centres and ask them how etc.
I think anybody who has just got an 808 should do a test on HSPA (which I believe shows on all Belle devices as "3.5G" on the top right corner, if it's available; it tends to be available in large metropolitan centres and near big roads, though almost never in UK countryside which is mostly GPRS only) and download a longish video or a known large file. And report the outcome, with the IMEI.
^ nice.. that sounds encouraging! Have you been driving/moving around a lot ? That seems to be when the issue occurs the most... I was driving in San Jose last night and the phone restarted 3 times in .. 20 mins or so... pretty bad.
I will send mine in this week and I will report back when I get the phone.
If it is what I think it is, then it would appear in a weak signal environment, which is where the phone will turn up its transmit power to max.
Plus you would actually have to be using mobile data at the time.
Nokia must have tested the phone but perhaps forgot to test it with a weak signal (max transmitter power).
It's also possible that the carrier might affect it. Some might have a slower network (longer gaps between packets) on which less power will be needed.
2013-01-14 22:14 - edited 2013-01-14 22:14
royemunson - what is your IMEI and which retailer did it come from?
I have thus far contacted every retailer I could find and none of them appear to know anything about this, and none have any means of contacting Nokia and asking them.
Barl Trading is one of the very few who never replied to anything. Zero pre-sales communications is a bad sign.
So the fix is probably not a "transistor" and certainly not a "capacitor" as widely written on the web.
I tend to agree with this conclusion. I got my phone from repair (actually got a "new" device), it rebooted several times in the beginning, and then behaved for almost a month. If not for those initial reboots, I would have thought they indeed fixed it. If it were a transistor or a capacitor, they probably would have found this long ago. It is totally unpredictable this bug. Sometimes it happens when I travel, but recently the phone rebooted several times with no obvious reason. One time when I was speaking to someone on the phone.
I am curious about 1508 upgrade. Did anyone find it?
What's your IMEI?
It also occurred to me that maybe what triggers this is transmission by the phone (i.e. uploading) of a significant amount of data via HSPA.
Downloading isn't going to use much power.
2013-01-16 12:49 - edited 2013-01-16 12:56
today 16.01.2013 my new swapped 808 has arrived from w - support germany.
they swapped original BV-4D 1400mAh Battery with BL-4D 1200mAh... ((((((
my code is 059M958.
imei changed to 351965050XXXXXX
i have to check wether same bug is still present or not ....
keep you updated....
2013-01-16 16:58 - edited 2013-01-16 17:07
I have written to all known UK 808 vendors and of the few who replied with IMEIs of their stock, none of them is selling 35196505191xxxx (reported above as working OK) or anything later.
Most have no idea and no way of finding out. They are just selling agents for product which is shipped by somebody else from Hong Kong etc.
Of course it's also possible that they know about this issue and are trying to shift their stock, hoping that most people won't notice. At best you get only 30 days to send it back for a refund, after which you are stuffed and they have your money and can just tell you to send it back to Hong Kong for a service, which obviously few people are going to do.
I would also not buy an 808 from outside the EU (whether or not it is a grey import is a separate issue) because when the package comes, there is a > 50% chance of getting a hit on import duty and VAT, plus the post office charge for collecting it, which wipes out any savings. This rules out most Ebay sellers of the 808, and most Amazon sellers too.
Over the course of six months I bought and returned seven 808's to Amazon. Yes, seven. They were all defective and all suffered from the random reboot and loss of connectivity issue. I kept each device for close to a month hoping Nokia would come out with a firmware upgrade that would fix the device. This obviously never happened and the only way to use the device somewhat reliably was to disable HSPA. But because there is a huge speed difference on AT&T between having HSPA enabled and disabled this wasn't an ideal situation.
So after returning the seventh one I decided the next one I bought I would send in to Nokia for repair. Because I'd be sending it in, I decided not to buy a new one but bought a used one from Amazon's Warehouse Deals instead. I paid $350 for one that was described as being in "good" condition and had it in my hands a few days later. Of course within the first hour of using it, it rebooted several times. So I went to the "warranty checker" page on Nokia's site, filled in the details of the issue I was having and sent the phone off to repair on January 7th.
On January 10th I received an email from Nokia letting me know they had determined that my device was defective and that they had shipped me a new phone. I received the new phone on January 12th and have been running it hard for the last few days. Good news! I haven't had one reboot since I've received the new unit. I know it's only been a few days but on every prior device I'd have reboots within the first hour of using it.
They included a note with the new phone which shows the old phone threw a fault code of 4399 (not sure what this means). For those of you interested, the new phone was built on the 26th week of 2012, its product code is 059P728 and its IMEI is 35196505058xxxx.