[peterh338]

Hi All,

I am a software developer, so not exactly dumb, hopefully

I have two of these, identically configured. Both have 30-40MB space left on C: despite having only a few apps installed and all possible efforts having been made to install them elsewhere, in the ~1GB bulk memory or (with Nokia Maps) on the 32GB micro-SD card.

The low memory now prevents even Nokia updates installing.

I have been browsing around with both Files and ActiveFile and done a lot of googling on how to clean up trash and temp files (low c: space is a huge issue on the later Nokias, evidently, with mobile forums covered in desperate pleas for help but with very few suggestions) but cannot get it any better. On Phone #1 the free space is showing as 33.5MB.

There are a pile of apps like CheckIn, Guides, Video Editor, etc, which either have no Delete option, or the delete option says Removing Cancelled (in the case of e.g. Orkut, Movie Teasers, etc.

I am suspecting that all is not as it should be and something left behind some temp files.

Is there a "garbage collection" utility (like ccleaner for Windows) which actually works on the 700 (Belle)?

The apps I have installed are

AFtrack

Maps

Drive

ActiveFile

KeepitOn

Joikuspot

LeGPSdata

AdobeReader

and that is all I want. I would like Google Maps but if I install that, I end up losing a number of MB, plus a load more in map tiles if I actually use it.

The stuff I don't want, but cannot delete so I moved it to a folder called Unwanted are

PublicTransport

MsgReader

OviMusic

CheckIn

Zip

Guides

Video editor

Photo editor

Topapps

Movie teasers

Orkut

NFC tutorials

Nat Geo

E!

CNN video

Tops and offers

Dictionary

About

Videos

Weather

Microsoft Apps

Clock

but none of them can be deleted, either from the front menu or from the Installed Apps list under Settings.

I see Nokia Store Installer under Settings / Already Installed as 5MB, which is a lot, but don't I need this app to install software on the phone? Same with ovi Store, 3MB. SSOUI shows there as 2MB but cannot be removed.

I would appreciate any help, here 

Moderator's notes: e-mail address removed. Nokia does not recommend users to post sensitive information on the forums. 

[peterh338]

I see the mods got to this quick to remove my email address but otherwise nobody else has commented.

Is there really zero knowledge here on the inner workings of the Symbian O/S?

I also tried Nokia support (with the same message) but got the usual script monkeys, returning banal replies without any understanding of the question.

[peterh338]

Update:

I used the Files app to see how much stuff is on c:

319MB memory in use
38MB free memory (was 27MB before I started deleting)
48kb calendar
226kb contacts
68MB messages (was 75MB before cleaning out Messages and Mail mailboxes)
0B images
0B sound files
0B videos

Where is the 68MB sitting? The only "messaging" apps I know about are Messaging and Mail and I cleaned those out completely.

My #2 Nokia 700, which has hardly been used, shows very similar figures and 77MB Messages, and 47MB free memory, increasing to 58.5MB free (68MB messages) after I cleaned out all messages.

So both phones are showing 68MB "messages" using Nokia's built in Files app. This can't be a coincidence, although #2 phone was cloned (using Nokia Suite Sync) from #1 phone so perhaps it is not suprising. But where are these mysterious "messages" ?

I looked at all directories displayed by Files and did the Details on each, and none of them were showing more than 1MB. So the stuff must be elsewhere.

The other ActiveFile browser (which shows all the directories on the phone) shows both c:\temp and c:\tmp empty.

Some of the directories are full e.g. c:\resource\apps is showing 1495 files but I have no way to see the total size of a directory using ActiveFile.

IMHO, the #1 phone somehow ended up with a 68MB orphaned data block, and this got cloned into the #2 phone using Nokia Suite.

[peterh338]

FOUND IT:

After a lot of work I found c:\private\1000484b is where Mail messages are stored.

On #1 phone there was a .tmp file there of about 5MB, so I deleted that. #2 phone doesn't have that file. So my #1 phone free space is now 43.5MB. This is obviously an OS bug.

Next, I copied the whole c:\private directory to the micro-sd card (so I could quickly browse it under winXP, via USB, looking at how big each directory was) and fairly quickly I found this

c:\private\00001001_S\d\0010077d_F

where there was a 67MB .mp4 file!!

The other way to find that file was to use the Find function in ActiveFile and look for *.mp4.

This is after I deleted all media!

Now, the Files app shows free space on c: as 126.7MB.

Possibly, one this may have happened is this: When the phone is shipped, all media goes to c: (which is brain dead) but anybody with a brain will change the camera app to use the micro-sd card (or bulk memory, but not c). But if you have recorded any media, and *then* you do the change, the media recorded on c: will never be seen again. However, why does the phone store .mp4 media in the c:\private directory in the first place? That is completely wrong. It may have been an emailed (sent by me) attachment which got orphaned.

I similarly looked for *.jpg but found none.

I suspect both these are OS bugs, leaving files behind.Now I have ~120MB space on c:

But the c:\private directory is not visible on a standard phone

[aspergerguy]

@peterh338

Credit to you for resolving this issue but as my 700 has 99MB of free phone memory with more applications installed than yourself I still wonder what is going on here!

[peterh338]

I will keep looking

I now have 110MB on #1 and 130MB on #2. That 20MB difference alone is suspicious, since their config is supposed to be the same.

Anyway, you need at least ~70MB to be able to apply the various Nokia updates.

I am still working on how to delete the built-in apps. Obviously their executables are wasting space; it may not be much in which case I will leave them.

It's also funny what you can find on google AFTER you have found a big clue yourself. If you google on

symbian 1000484b

the results are rather illuminating. Countless people have been up this path before. Very frustrating! The actual O/S is very well documented here

http://library.developer.nokia.com/index.jsp?topic=/S60_5th_Edition_Cpp_Developers_Library/GUID-3522...

but it will take you a year to read through it. No wonder Symbian has been described as an excellent O/S but one which is difficult to write apps for well.

[peterh338]

OK... done some more work on this.

A couple of huge files on c : \private\2002ae6c

search_default.ln 13MB
handler.db 11MB

These appear to be search results or indexes. Why does the OS leave them behind?

I am not sure whether these can be safely deleted.

Then there is 20MB of stuff (actual size on disk) to do with Orkut, Natgeovideo, and other nonsense, under \10282822.

[peterh338]

And, after several more hours, I have found that my c: \ private directory on phone #1 is still about 30MB bigger than on phone #2.This I think will be the end of the problems - when I find it.

This one is however proving very tricky because the method I used to rapidly examine the directory (copying using ActiveFile to the micro-SD card and looking at it on a PC) fails for whichever the offending directory is; it is quietly skipped during the copy. So I am going to have to go through all 200? directories, one by one, using ActiveFile and doing Properties on each one, to see which one has the mysterious orphaned file(s)....

I don't understand why Nokia is not offering a "cleanup" utility, along the lines of Ccleaner for Windows. If C: was a few GB it wouldn't matter but it isn't; the space on it is very tight.

[peterh338]

And here is more for anyone who cares

After a lot of work, comparing the c: \private directory between two N700 phones (one heavily used and one not but otherwise identically configured) I see a directory called 20034169.

It contains a lot of stuff which vaguely appears related to the Nokia Maps / Nokia Drive apps, but one can't tell:

handler.db is 14MB in #1 and 10.9MB in the other.
searchdefault.ln is 15.6MB and 7.5MB respectively.
store.db is 4.2MB and 3.3MB respectively.

So, this is a similar case to 2002ae6c which contains the same set of huge files (why have two almost identical directories with such huge files?) but in that one the differences between phone #1 and #2 are smaller.

handler.db is 11MB in #1 and 11.7MB in the other (i.e. bigger in #2!)
searchdefault.ln is 12.7MB and 9.1MB respectively.
store.db is 3.8MB and 3.3MB respectively.

A google on those directory names shows, sure enough, that others have been up this path before but (as usual) met with a brick wall. This man suspects that they are left behind by a beta version of Nokia Search

http://discussions.nokia.com/t5/Nseries-and-Symbian-Smartphones/Some-application-service-creates-fol...

I have 75MB of apparent garbage just in those two directories, with most of it in 6 files.

Can these directories be safely deleted? I am not doing that in case it breaks something.

This IS a serious problem because Belle has removed the config option on where to store emails, forcing all to be sored on c: , so if you get a few emails with large attachments in your inbox, your phone is useless.

[hpholm]

@peterh338:

Thank you for the work and for posting your findings here!

I hope Nokia is listening and develop better garbage collection routines for the low C: space problem.

My N8 with "Anna" firmware and its built-in Maps 3.06, Store 2.08.042 + the usual collection of must-have apps installed mostly on C: does not have this problem, even after months of everyday use, so Nokia have managed before.

--

Hans

[peterh338]

This morning I found that none of the files in 2002ae6c are later than May 2012, whereas the 20034169 one has most files dated today, and they get refreshed daily.

So I think 2002ae6c is a remnant from some firmware upgrade.

But it would be good to know what this stuff really is, before I delete it, with a risk of bricking the phone.

[Ztuka]

I have the Nokia 700 and also the Nokia 701.
The memory in C is less in 700 from the beginning. Recomend reflash at Nokia service center. The updatr through hard reset and reinstallment through isnt cöean. Anyhow not for swedish sold 700. My 700 is bought in Sweden and 701 in Germany.
I will actually reflash them both in the next weeks to come by myself or at a Nokia servecenter. Mobilbyran.se in Stockholm for swedish people.

[peterh338]

Why would you want to re-flash a phone which you bought brand new a few months previously, which has had only a few apps installed (and all of those are ones I need) and which has mysterious c: space issues?

All that a re-flash will do is take you back to when you bought it, so you will go through the same path again.

It's far better to find out what is causing this and do a clean-up of the offending data, and then if the issue repeats (which is highly likely) you have a solution.

[peterh338]

I did a google on

0x2002ae6c symbian

and straight away found a URL that shows 2002ae6c is Smart Search, as had been suspected. I never use that program so it looks like it can be safely deleted.

No hits on 0x20034169 which contains the same data. Maybe this ID was allocated only with the last Nokia firmware update - a few weeks ago.

[hpholm]

The search harvester / indexing routines collect data from everything on the phone, contacts, messages, calendar, mp3 files etc. The other directory sounds as the previous version of the search results, serving as a backup.

The files will most likely be recreated after deleting, but only the Nokia/Accenture programmers (if any!) know what is safe to delete in the Private directory on C:

Hans

[peterh338]

Can the search be turned off?

I thought Search was a dedicated app, which runs only when you run it.

It sounds like both directories can be safely deleted

[hpholm]

The search auto-start can be disabled in its settings, but I'm not sure if it will prevent the harvester hidden process from doing what it wants to do. You are in uncharted territory!

[peterh338]

Where is the search auto-start config in its Settings? The only option I see is whether it will search online.

BTW I can confirm that deleting the contents of 2002ae6c does not brick the phone. It seems to run fine, and I have recovered about 30MB on c:

[hpholm]

---

peterh338 wrote:

Where is the search auto-start config in its Settings? The only option I see is whether it will search online.

---

Something is different from my N8 and your 700 ... Perhaps the Belle FP1 that the N8 will never get?

If you are at 100MB+ free space on C: with updates and the usual apps installed, with pictures and music loaded in mass memory, then I suggest you stop poking around while the phone still works.

--

Hans

[peterh338]

I agree

For the benefit of anybody finding themselves in the same situation, let me summarise...

If your phone has not been hacked i.e. you cannot access the c: \private directory (Files never can but ActiveFile can on a hacked phone) then all you can do is:

1. Avoid keeping any emails of any significant size (stupidly they reside on c: and this cannot be changed) and if you download any with large attachments, delete them ASAP

2. Avoid keeping thousands of SMS messages. They are very small but large numbers will add up.

3. Avoid sending large emails e.g. over 10MB which may be refused by the SMTP server and get stuck in your Outbox. It is tempting to take a movie of say 50MB and email it to yourself (as an easy means of transfer) when at home on wifi, but this is how I ended up with that 60MB .mp4 under c: \private\1000484b which is of course totally inaccessible on a non-hacked phone. This is definitely a bug.

4. Install every app (that offers the option) in Bulk Memory (e: ) not Phone Memory (c: ).

5. Delete every app you don't need. Most of the apps that come with the phone, or subsequent updates, are garbage but most of them cannot be deleted. Some do take up space on c: (I found Nat Geographic takes up several MB) however.

If your phone has been hacked (and the mods here will not allow discussion of how to do that, but google is your friend; it's all over the internet) then do all of above, plus do the following using ActiveFile (or a better tool if you can find one)

1. Delete all files in c: \private\1000484b (this is where emails and possibly SMSs are kept).

2. Delete all files in any temp or tmp directory (there are a number of them around)

3. Delete any .tmp files

4. Delete all files in c : \private\2002ae6c (this comes from the Nokia Search function) but first verify that the dates on the files there are not today's date. If they are current i.e. today then IMHO best to leave them alone. On my phone I found that the data in 2002ae6c was "abandoned" a few months earlier and a new set created in 20034169, which I didn't dare delete. If you google on 0x2002ae6c you get some explanations...

5. Look around and delete any data relating to caches from apps which have been uninstalled e.g. Google Maps. Some of this is stupidly stored on c: also.

6. After each Nokia firmware update, go through the process again because a lot of the garbage apps get reinstalled.

The above steps should give you at least 100MB free space on c: My #1 phone went from 25MB to 122MB free space. My #2 phone (same config as #1 but hardly used) is around 150MB free space.

I would also consider disabling all future updates. This is standard practice on any "mission critical" computer, and I have not noticed any real functional improvements in the last 1 or 2 updates. All that Nokia are doing is tidying up little bits on the user interface. No new functionality (that I have noticed) has been introduced.