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Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equa...

Sage
britzinelul24
Posts: 223

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

I hope that the update it will be very soon
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Mobile Overlord
grschinon
Posts: 10,192

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

@jauhis:

Thanks for taking the time to post again.

I appreciate the fact that your hands are tied with respect to how much you can reveal on public boards such as this one, which is why I also think the matter should be raised further up the hierarchy.

We users of UK CV unbranded S60v5 handsets in the UK are entitled to an explanation more in detail than "approval has to come from regulatory bodies, networks etc.". We paid good money up front in order not to have to wait for network operators for updates and features and we didn't get what we paid for. We ended up having to play second fiddle to operator-subsidised handsets, and by a long chalk. That is just not on. We are now 2 versions behind the rest of the world.

Where's my refund? Oh, I'm probably not getting one as that would open the floodgates for all kinds of problems. I appreciate that. I DO want an explanation, though. As has been asked several times by users here, what is it about the UK that makes it so difficult to get approval for the firmware updates? If it's because of technical issues, how come people can come over from abroad and use their handsets with later firmware versions? In what areas is the "British Isles" variant different from the "UK" variant and why can owners of that particular variant update to V30 at least now?

Is Nokia HQ trying to sink Nokia UK by enticing people to buy their handsets in continental Europe (and thus get a EURO variant, which can be updated) but still rely on Nokia Care UK for the warranty?

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Sage
Posts: 305

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality


jauhis wrote:

 

Generally speaking, there are countries where approvals take time for various reasons. The delays may be due to diverse verification requirements set by local authorities and network providers. Also plain consumer demand plays somewhat of a factor, but only for priorization purposes.


Reading that above, I am feeling like Nokia is trying to test WMDs or something on other countries' soil, therefore that is why these "delays, verification, authorizations, etc." are taking forever. What is so big deal about publishing and updated version of firmware that has already been released? I wish Nokia could explain this process to us in more detail. Because when we call the operators, or local Nokia centers, they BLAME you. They say YOU are the cause of these delays. Yes, they do. They throw the ball at you. :smileyhappy:

 

Secondly NOKIA, and listen very good here, about "plain consumer demand plays somewhat of a factor". Please do not forget that this site is mainly in English. I travel to many "non-English speaking" countries, and SOME you may consider "underdeveloped or still developing" countries, but let me tell you they still CARE PRETTY MUCH about firmware updates. This is very important. Just because some markets, groups, can't speak English here, does not mean that they care ANY LESS about firmware updates than others.

 

I also know for a fact that Nokia's market shares are also pretty high on some of those markets, too.

 

The bottom line is, if you just be "fair & equal" to everyone, you won't have any problems like this. If we are going to wait for an update, let's ALL wait. Not some. I am in for that.

 

Psycho where are you? Back me up on this! :smileyhappy:

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Counsellor
Posts: 35

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

zxon, in Finland we have a sauna in every house - it has always been like that. But even in sauna we are waiting the new firm ware, too...  :smileyhappy:
E7, N8, Lumia 800, Lumia 900
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Counsellor
Posts: 39

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

well said i agree with you 100%

 

not just uk the world should get the firmware at the same time this branding **bleep** is stupid

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Advisor
katastrofic
Posts: 13

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

Nokia loosing clients and gone loose more.... Buying one of theirs mobiles doesnt makes life easier even harder w8ting for patches.

 

I think its the end for symbian OS.

 

My N97 is hard to call smartfone cause i can only use it to make calls nothing more (freezes - crashes etc) I cant even download firmware - where the logic is to sell anything?

N3210 * N3310 * N6210 * N8210 * N7650 * N6630 * E65 * N95 * N97 RM-505 v2.0
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Contributor
Posts: 8

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

Newtype...... I TOTALLY AGREE.  The people in Europe complaining always make me chuckle a bit (no offense to those guys) because here in the US, we CONSTANTLY get the high hard one when it comes to FW updates.  CONSTANTLY.

 

 

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Contributor
Posts: 8

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

 

....in addition to my last post....

 

I THINK I SPEAK FOR THE MAJORITY when saying that if we're gonna have to deal with waiting and getting shafted with inconsistent update service..... at LEAST NOKIA COULD ACKNOWLEDGE some d@mn specifics with the public to AT LEAST let us know what's going one, what takes so long, why a FW is delayed for a certain market, etc etc.

 

Apple in the US is a new guy but at least they announce problems, their anticipated fix date (or even that they are being LOOKED AT) etc etc.

 

NOKIA should communicate with their customer base.  Studies have shown that the #1 best trait a company can have is GOOD CUSTOMER SERVICE.  They want info or at least an open dialogue with companies about issues concerning their products.  I spend a LOT of money on Nokia products and all I ask is a bit of courtesy when it comes to issues, problems, updates and KNOWN issues. 

 

After all, Nokia is a "COMMUNICATIONS" company.  SO...... COMMUNICATE!!

 

:smileyhappy:  rant over for now

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Mobile Overlord
grschinon
Posts: 10,192

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

@paliometoxo:

I agree that the whole branding thing is a huge source of problems, but we have to remember that the industry is controlled by the networks, not by the equipment manufacturers.

If Nokia were to stop allowing networks to brand their phones, the networks would stop buying them. Plain and simple. That's why Nokia got off to a bad start in the USA. They were very late in allowing network branding, so the US networks shunned them and turned to other brands that did allow it.

Network branding is a necessary evil. Without it there wouldn't be any Nokia handsets here at all.

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Advisor
Posts: 20

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

So what about 5800. Hoping to hear good news.
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Counsellor
realredfox
Posts: 46

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

yeah I hope he wasn't only referring to the v31 firmware for the uk but an actual update like the v2.0 for the n97.
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Counsellor
Posts: 33

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

I can't see the 5800 getting any updates other than bugfixes - kinetic scrolling and widgets would be lovely, but I don't think it's going to happen imo.

 

Back on topic, I highly doubt the criteria for the UK market (which is apperently more stringent than other countries) is supposed to be secret.

 

Even if this is the case, at what point is the delay? Network testing? I doubt that since they delay their own FW updates, they don't verify ones for simfree models. So one has to assume it's some other body.

 

Is there nothing happening to streamline this? Sometimes it's just improvements, but quite often it's very crucial fixes which need fixing fast.

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Sage
bitflung
Posts: 272

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality


newtype2011 wrote:
I honestly feel what you all are saying, but you guys don't have to wait nearly as long for updates as we have to in the states. Only up until recently are we even getting the same updates as the rest of the world. Our N96s never even made it to the latest version -_-
newtype2011 is right.  with the s60v5 handsets as exceptions, the UK gets delays while NAM models get flat-out cancellations and we're lucky to get a firmware a year later than the UK.
i'd be annoyed too, but man you've got it so much better than we have had it in the past.  s60v5 based handsets are a breathe of fresh air for us though, finally getting updates like everyone else (and on top of that, also getting them in a timely fashion).
and to those that can't figure what the regional requirements are: most countries have a set of requirements for privacy and security.  for example, in the USA all phones must be capable of dialing 911 regardless of what, if any, SIM is inserted.  (911 is our emergency hotline).  other stuff like providing GPS locale to the 911 operator and ensuring the camera makes noises when used are also locally enforced.  each country has its own set of rules and these are always moving targets.  ie: in the USA phones dont HAVE to enable GPS sharing to emergency operators, but 'should'.  eventually they will HAVE TO.  then, the NAM variant firmware will ship, but USA specific models will have to wait until the US people qualify the firmware for distribution in this country.
 my guess: UK requires something extra that wasn't done exactly to spec by Nokia, or that nokia met the spec, but the UK requirements increased before the firmware shipped.  the final possibility is that the UK regulatory offices take a long long time to certify a new firmware revision for distribution to phones sold within their jurisdiction.
prior posts seem to insinuate the later is the actual problem, but any combination of those could result is a long time for regional (UK in this case) updates to be realized when the rest of the world has already updated.  supposedly, these types of problems would have been the issues with NAM variants in the past - that the requirements were too different in the NAM markets and the number of affected users too few to justify the investment in making the changes.  new OS improvements should enable an easier time implementing these changes (i'm guessing that's why s60v5 is updated in the NAM market more readily) but nothing Nokia does can fix a bureaucratic system being slow (lawmakers have to make it LOOK like they are doing work in order to keep their jobs).
-bit 

 

---
N95-1 ---> N97-NAM ---> N900 ---> E7-00 + N900 (I use them both)
(N95 was pretty good, N97 had potential but utterly failed to deliver, N900 is absurdly good. Those of you wondering, "should I try N900/Maemo/MeeGo"? The answer is a resounding YES)
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Mobile Emperor
psychomania
Posts: 28,334

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

[ Edited ]

If you feel that strongly about it then start your own campaign for the US users. Please don't send this thread off topic.

 

This campaign is just for owners of unbranded UK models.  The UK's delays are caused by a 3rd party support company that isn't doing their jobs properly, not by anything thats unique to our phones/networks.

Message Edited by psychomania on 12-Oct-2009 04:10 PM
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Sage
bitflung
Posts: 272

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality


psychomania wrote:

If you feel that strongly about it then start your own campaign for the US users. Please don't send this thread off topic.

 

This campaign is just for owners of unbranded UK models.  The UK's delays are caused by a 3rd party support company that isn't doing their jobs properly, not by anything thats unique to our phones/networks.

Message Edited by psychomania on 12-Oct-2009 04:10 PM

sorry 'bout that, i followed a link to this thread from someone complaining about v2 not coming out today after all.  didnt take the time to read the topic and note that this wasn't a thread about fw updates in general.  would edit the post to prevent offtopic follow ups at this point, but looks like i left it too long, edit is not an option at the moment.
good luck on your campaign.  
-bit 

 

---
N95-1 ---> N97-NAM ---> N900 ---> E7-00 + N900 (I use them both)
(N95 was pretty good, N97 had potential but utterly failed to deliver, N900 is absurdly good. Those of you wondering, "should I try N900/Maemo/MeeGo"? The answer is a resounding YES)
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Mobile Emperor
psychomania
Posts: 28,334

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

Cheers, no harm done.

 

Hopefully updates will improve one day for everyone everywhere.  For now i'm sticking to the UK unbranded because if we can't change one countries policy then what hope do we have for all of them?

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Advisor
Posts: 18

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality


psychomania wrote:

 

The UK's delays are caused by a 3rd party support company that isn't doing their jobs properly, not by anything thats unique to our phones/networks.

Message Edited by psychomania on 12-Oct-2009 04:10 PM

 

I'd be really interested to know more about this. Sorry if its been covered at some point - I've only been following the thread for the last few weeks and haven't had a chance to read it from the start.
 
Who is this company, what do they (or should they) do? 
 
 
 
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Mobile Emperor
psychomania
Posts: 28,334

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

Basically in the UK a number of 3rd party companies are responsible for aftersales support which includes testing and approving new firmware.

 

The company that is believed (but not confirmed) to be responsible for this poor service is called Regenersis.  They are well known for doing seriously poor quality repairs to peoples phones so it looks like the company is just bad in general.

 

What I would like to see happen is nokia step in and handle UK updates directly like they do for many other countries as the 3rd parties are doing nothing but give nokia a bad reputation.

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Advisor
Posts: 20

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

Hoping for jauhis to reply about 5800 update. Sweden is also still on v21 like UK
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Registered Member
Posts: 2

Re: Firmware Updates in the UK - Campaign for Equality

You can update the 5800 to firmware 30 in the UK with O2 but not with T-mobile. T-mobile will not allow the update which is a disgrace. I know many O2 people who have updated. So its not Nokia holding it back it is the networks
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